Ancestry’s DNA Survey

Posted on October 15, 2012 by Roberta Estes

I received an e-mail asking me to take a survery for Ancestry.com about my experience with their autosomal AncestryDNA product. Glory be – did they realize what they were asking???

Always anxious to improve our experience, and somewhat curious, I took the survey. Most of the questions had “buttons” ranging from strongly agree to strongly disagree. Many questions were very general in nature and asked if you had discovered something new about yourself or your family, if you had made a connection with someone new, etc. I can just see the resulting marketing now: “More than 90% of our customers found a new relative as a result of DNA testing. You can too!”

In one case, I indicated that I “strongly disagreed” and the next question was a text box and a question about why I disagreed, but not all “strongly disagree” answers produced text boxes. I took that opportunity to say that I was unhappy about not having chromosome mapping or raw data to download. As the questions continued, it became clear why these tools are not a priority to Ancestry.

The clincher, and the real driving factor behind these tests was revealed with this question: “How likely are you to continue subscribing to Ancestry.com as a result of your AncestryDNA experience?” Of course, they didn’t preface the question by telling people that if they don’t continue subscribing, they won’t have access to their matches. And at Ancestry, the are no “results” as we think if them at other companies – so your matches ARE your result, aside from percentages of ethnicity.

The phrasing of the questions and the focus was clearly on the “social” aspect of connecting with people. The Ancestry experience is not about science, and those of us who want to use it as such are simply frustrated and unhappy, and unfortunately, probably in the minority.

However, the Ancestry interface is easy to use, cleanly written and for those whom the science frustrates and who don’t understand how to use chromosome mapping tools, or why one would want to, the Ancestry experience is “easier” and “more fulfilling” to quote someone from a list earlier in the week.

I am hopeful that as Ancestry matures this product, they will also provide the value and tools for their more scientifically inclined customers. This is not new technology and these tools are clearly available, because Family Tree DNA and 23andMe provide them, but Ancestry does not.

If Ancestry did that, well, then I MIGHT be inclined to remain subscribed BECAUSE of my AncestryDNA results. And I might be inclined to REFER people, especially adoptees who need to fish in every pool available. Did you hear that Ancestry?

Today, all those match results do is to frustrate me because I so desperately need the chromosome data that Ancestry holds hostage.

We may be a minority, but we must continue to be a vocal minority, that squeeky wheel. If you have the opportunity to take this survey, please use the opportunity to ask for the features and functions we so badly need. Speak to them in terms they understand – Ancestry.com subscriptions.

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What to Order? – Geno 2.0 vs Family Tree DNA Products

Posted on October 14, 2012 by Roberta Estes

Update: Please note that the Genographic kits are no longer available, but the Family Tree DNA products are. You can click here to order.

There have been a lot of questions lately about what to order from whom and why relative to the Geno 2.0 kit and the Family Tree DNA products. I’ve but together the following table as a “cheat sheet” that includes the basic reasons that people order one versus the other, or both.

In a nutshell, if it’s genealogy you’re interested in, then you want to order the Family Tree DNA products because they provide you with specific mutation locations, the mutation values and a list of matches to other people based on those mutations. The Geno 2.0 tests are more anthropological (deep ancestry) in nature. In some cases, specifically the Y-line testing, these tests go hand in hand.

Product Desired	Family Tree DNA	Geno 2.0
Y-Line
Markers for genealogy, matches with other people in a genealogical timeframe	12, 25, 37, 67 and 111 markers and values, includes matches and other tools	No
Haplogroup assignment	Included with purchase of above markers at a general level. Can then order additional SNP tests or Geno 2.0 to obtain deeper results.	Extensive – deepest available within industry and inclusive of SNPs discovered through November 2011
Ethnicity of that specific line based on haplogroup assignment	Yes	Yes
Maps, haplogroup origins	Yes	Yes
Mitochondrial DNA
Mutations for genealogy, matches with other people in a genealogical timeframe	mtDNA (HVR1), mtDNAPlus (HVR1+HVR2) and full sequence mutations, includes matches and other tools.	No
Haplogroup assignment	Included with purchase at general level. Full assignment at deepest level with the full sequence.	Yes, deepest level.
Ethnicity of that specific line based on haplogroup assignment	Yes	Yes
Maps, haplogroup origins	Yes	Yes
Autosomal	Family Finder
Ethnicity percentages for all ancestral lines combined*	Yes	Yes
Cousin matches	Yes, list of matches provided with common surnames if information provided by tester	No
Download of data	Yes	Yes
Transfer to Family Tree DNA	N/A	Yes – must be manually initiated
Social Networking Tools	No	Yes – not at initial release

*Note that the ethnicity percentages will be calculated using different base populations and the results will likely be somewhat different. The National Geographic product is using new SNP data gathered through their field work within the Genographic Project. So while this information is provided in both tests, I would not presume it will be the same nor that it is duplicative.

This table isn’t meant to be a description or comparison of every feature in the various tests, but the decision criteria to purchase one type of test versus the other.

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Ancestry Autosomal Results are Back

Posted on September 10, 2012 by Roberta Estes

My cousin, Harold, e-mailed me and asked me to check my Ancesry results to see if I matched a certain nickname (user). I told him I’d be glad to when my results come in, sometime in October. He replied that my results are in and have been for a couple days, as I’ve been showing as a match to him. Hmmm….would have been nice if Ancestry had notified me. We’ll chalk this up to the internet troll eating the e-mail notification message. Thank you cousin Harold.

When Ancestry received my kit on August 21st, they said to expect my results in 6-8 weeks. They beat their own mark by at least 50%. It took about 3 weeks instead of 6-8. Everyone is always happy receiving something early. It’s all about setting expectations correctly, and they did.

I was excited to take a look. Sure enough, there was cousin Harold, right up at the top of the match list. Harold and I have been working on a particulary elusive genealogy problem for some time now, so both of us test everyplace we can in the hopes of cracking this tough nut. In a future blogs, we’ll talk about using genetic genealogy to do focused testing and solve very specific problems.

I only have just a few minutes this morning, so it’s a good thing that Ancestry’s user interface is easy and intuitive.

I was disappointed to see that Scandinavian show up. I know beyond any doubt that I’m not 12% Scandinavian. That’s equivalent to one great-grandparent. I did a pedigree analysis as part of a paper titled Revealing American Indian and Minority Heritage Using Y-line, Mitochondrial, Autosomal and X Chromosomal Testing Data Combined with Pedigree Analysisthat was published in the Journal of Genetic Genealogy. CeCe Moore has already reported on this false Scandinavian problem at Ancestry.

Given my time constraints this morning, I had to limit myself to a quick test drive. I have one 3rd cousin match, Harold, nineteen 4th cousins and 90 distant matches. In total 122 matches and of those, only 14 don’t have pedigree charts, although I’ve noticed that some charts are very skeletal, with only parents and maybe grandparents listed.

I couldn’t resist scrolling down the list and clicking on “review match” links for the 4th cousins. I find the “nicknames” frustrating. Some are marginally recognizable. I use my full name in mine, but others are entirely obfuscated.

I had no idea who Alyssa2309 was, but she is listed third on my 4th cousin list, so I clicked on Review Match. Much to my surprise, she is truly a cousin. My great-grandfather is her great-great-great-grandfather. I was very glad at this moment that I had taken the time to manually enter my pedigree chart information for 10 generations. Without that information, Ancestry could not have connected our common ancestors on our trees.

Ok, that’s very cool. This isn’t a brick wall line for me, but it’s still fun to find a new cousin. Maybe she has some photos that I don’t, or vice versa. Alyssa2309, I’ll be in touch, count on it! Here’s a picture of our common ancestors, Lazarus Estes (1845-1919) and Elizabeth Vannoy (1846-1918).

I continued clicking. It has now taken on an addictive quality and I’m only through about 5. Oops, I’ve hit my first “private” tree. How disappointing. I wish Ancestry had done the common surname analysis so I know whether or not to bother attempting to contact this person.

You can see, above, that Ancestry compares the charts of the two people who match and shows you the shared surnames, in this case, the very common Miller and Moore. You can then click and go to that surname on the person’s pedigree chart, or you can simply scan down the chart, displayed to the right through 10 generations. This is a very nice feature.

I finished a quick look at my nineteen 4th cousins. Of those nineteen, there are three where I can clearly identify our common ancestor, and there are two or three more that with some genealogy digging, we might well be able to connect the dots. One of those is a dead end brick wall line for me, so I’m hopeful. More than half show no common surnames.

More than ever, now I really desperately need more information and the raw data to continue with my ancestor matching project. While the Ancestry match information is a tantalizing teaser, that’s all it is. They don’t show how or where you match, how much, segment size or number of SNPs, the chromosome(s), start and stop locations, nor the raw data, of course. No chromosome matching or mapping like at both Family Tree DNA and at 23andMe. How frustrating. It’s like showing you the tip of the iceberg and refusing to provide you with the rest, although you know full well it’s there and available, because other testing companies using the same test platform provide this information. This is SO FRUSTRATING!

In essence, we have the shiny user interface (complete with erroneous population data), and the surface matching information, but no substance. Nothing under the hood. Knowing there is information there that I need and can’t have is worse than not knowing at all.

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23andMe – 16 Days Door to Results

Posted on September 1, 2012 by Roberta Estes

On August 16th, I put kits for both Ancestry and 23andMe in the mail.

On August 21st, I received an e-mail from Ancestry telling me that my sample had arrived in their lab and that I could expect results in 6 to 8 weeks. That’s mid to late October.

On August 24th, I received an e-mail from 23andMe telling me that my sample had arrived in their lab and that I could expect results in 2-3 weeks. Only 7 days later, I received another e-mail that my results were ready. In total, 16 days door to computer, and only 7 days in the lab. That’s pretty amazing.

This kit was an upgrade from the first kits they had issued. This new kit was required for their new platform and one test in particular that I was interested in – the Alzheimer’s genetic susceptibility.

I’m very happy to report that I’m less than half as likely to develop Alzheimer’s than the general population. I’m sure my kids will be relieved to hear that too. Now if I could just remember where I put the phone, I’d call them and tell them:)

There are a couple of things I do think 23andMe could do a little differently.

1. I would like to have known what, other than the Alzheimer’s risk, was available to me on the new platform that wasn’t previously. There was no notification and had I not specifically known to look for the Alzheimer’s risk, I would have had no idea what I had received for my money.

2. Every time I sign in, they default to my daughter’s account which I manage. Now I love my daughter, but I want my account to default to, well, my account.

3. Finding the genealogy pieces of their offering is not at all straightforward. For example, where is the link to download raw results located? Just try to find it. Go ahead. And I know that the reason I can’t ever find it has nothing to do with Alzheimer’s. Actually, I have the link saved because wherever they’ve hidden it, they did a fine job.

4. I would surely love to see a “genealogy dashboard” for those of us who are so inclined. I think that would help with finding things and general friendliness of their site. I thought I saw something at one time in this vein, but if it’s there, well, I can’t find it.

One thing I noticed that I really like is the section under “23andMe” and then “Research Discoveries.” As customers, we take surveys and based on those surveys, they look for genetic similarities between those who do and don’t have the trait or conditions in question. On this page, they list their discoveries and tell you whether one of the surveys you took was involved. It made me feel good to know that I had contributed in a meaningful way.

And just for the record, in case you were wondering, no, I do not have back hair:)

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Is History Repeating Itself at Ancestry?

Posted on August 30, 2012 by Roberta Estes

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Is history repeating itself at Ancestry?

I’ve been thinking about whether or not I should publish this posting. As I write and rewrite it, I still haven’t made up my mind. It’s one of those sticky wickets, as they are called. One of the reasons I hesitate is that I have far more questions than answers.

One of the reasons I feel like I should publish it is because we, as a community, have far more questions than answers. I’m concerned that we’re being exploited, manipulated and deceived. I feel like we’re already on the way down a slippery slope, and I fear a flush is at the bottom. If that is true, we’re entirely powerless if we don’t know about it.

Since you are reading this, I obviously decided to publish it, so I’ll let you decide for yourself.

Over the past few weeks, I’ve been getting this sinking feeling in the pit of my stomach as Ancestry’s most recent DNA testing mess has unfolded like the leaves on the beautifully deceptive skunk plant. Yes, the skunk plant is named that for the reason you think…things just aren’t what they seem at first glance…and they smell….really smell. And by the time you figure out that you’ve made an error in judgment, you’re in the middle of a smelly mess.

This isn’t the first time that Ancestry has had some really significant problems with DNA testing and quality. However, this second time is more complex and includes ethics issues. I’m not sure where the problem lies, and maybe the answer isn’t in just one place, but multiple problems in multiple places.

Those who fail to learn from history are doomed to repeat it. Let’s take a look.

Ancestry and Sorenson

In 2002 Ancestry introduced DNA testing for their customers by partnering with Relative Genetics, an arm of Sorenson, which had just been formed. Of course, this was not autosomal testing, but Yline and mitochondrial DNA. To say this was unsuccessful is an understatement and being kind. Ancestry lost kits, having to eventually give refunds, “predicted” haplogroups dramatically incorrectly (paternal cousins in haplogroups R and G, respectively), and generally made a mess of DNA testing. Thankfully, they didn’t last long and one day – poof….gone. No more Ancestry.com DNA testing. The lab? Sorenson. What or where was the problem or problems? I have no idea. Just like the young girl who went away to live with “Auntie” and had a baby, it was never publicly discussed.

Let’s take a look at Sorenson.

Sorenson and GeneTree

Sorenson, www.smgf.org, was founded as a nonprofit research organization in 1999 by Mormon philanthropist, James Sorenson (deceased in 2008) in order to study the relationship between DNA and genealogy. Unlike other testing companies, initially there was no charge to submit your DNA, but you were required to include a 4 generation pedigree chart. You did not receive personal results. Your results were, in time, added with your pedigree to their data base. Their project to acquire DNA samples and pedigree charts came to an end in June 2009, and free testing was no longer available. They began selling DNA testing services through GeneTree.

In 2007, in a somewhat controversial move, since Sorenson was supposed to be nonprofit and research only, they reconfigured and “launched” GeneTree, a DNA paternity testing company that they had acquired in 2001.

In 2009, they began to offer a resource for people to be able to obtain their Sorenson results and matches for a fee. I was excited about being able to “unlock” my Sorenson matches as they advertised. I ordered this “unlock” for $39 the very first day it was available, and sure enough, I had several matches, BUT, none of them were unlocked, so I couldn’t “see” them. I was encouraged to contact my matches through an internal message system and ask them to also pay the $39 to unlock their results so we could “see each other.” I clearly didn’t understand the nature of ‘unlock”, or really, half-unlocked, when I spent my $39. However, I figured if I just waited, eventually, others would unlock theirs too. After all, it was the first day.

I didn’t have a good feeling about how this unfolded. I felt like they were just using their customers to recruit other customers AFTER they had paid their unlock fee. Kind of a mini dna pyramid scheme.

I checked back periodically, and one day, I could no longer access my results. I contacted GeneTree and was told I had never ordered the “unlock.” I sent them screen shots of my matches, which I had taken on the first day, but to no avail. I could either try to find my original receipt and use that as my next form of argument, or simply give up. I decided that since very few people were unlocking results, and none, of course, were full sequence, it was pretty much futile anyway and I didn’t spend any more time fighting with them. They obviously had no motivation to find my records and make it right. I went from feeling somewhat used by Sorenson/GeneTree to disgusted.

Ancestry’s ComeBack with Relative Genetics

After Ancestry’s first entrance and exit from the genetic genealogy playing field, they linked search-result surnames to Family Tree DNA’s projects. One day in 2006, we noticed the link was gone and suspected that they were preparing to reenter the DNA testing space, and indeed they did in 2007 by purchasing Relative Genetics, their earlier partner.

I never tested at Relative Genetics, but I do understand that their clients were notified and there was an opportunity to opt out of that transfer. Many people felt this should have been handled the other way – that you should have had to “opt-in” instead of opting out.

The Relative Genetics results were transferred into an Ancestry data base. Ancestry simultaneously began their own testing program, and allowed people who tested at other labs to manually enter their data as well. This increased Ancestry’s data base so that people who tested through Ancestry had results to compare to.

Ancestry still has issues with haplogroups because they don’t test SNPS. Until they do, they will never be able to correctly assign haplogroups.

Their mitochondrial DNA matching is chronically wrong. I have no idea how they do that, but anyone could do better with a simple spreadsheet, or even visually looking at the list. Quality controls are apparently absent, in this, the most simple of tasks, and it surely calls into question the level of quality control in place for more complex tasks and matching where we can’t see all of the data. This continual problem engenders no confidence at all, and the worst part is that it has been like this now for years and they have never fixed the issues. Either their quality control is sorely lacking, or they simply don’t care.

As far as I was concerned, I was thoroughly disgusted by this point. It had become apparent that adding people to their data base, in spite of clerically introduced mutations (typos), and generating revenue was a much higher priority than providing correct data on the back end. But then again, Ancestry, in their other businesses, has never been known for accuracy or quality – only for barely-acceptable levels of mediocrity.

Of course, Ancestry has been on a shopping spree – buying up anything that smells like competition.

Ancestry Buys Sorenson and Genetree

In May of 2012, Ancestry purchased GeneTree and the genealogical and anthropological assets of Sorenson, including their DNA data base. Those of us who had contributed our DNA to Sorenson for research purposes felt betrayed and exploited. Never did we imagine, in our wildest dreams, that our DNA would wind up with a commercial entity that would use our data, that was never “released” to us, to profit. Nor were we notified. If you managed to hear about this through the genealogy grapevine, there is apparently an “opt out” option if you contact Ancestry.com. I could not find a link, but calling their support number should do it. It’s unclear whether Ancestry actually bought the Sorenson lab. Sorenson still does Forensic work and the management team at Sorenson Forensics is different than the Ancestry team.

Ancestry and Autosomal DNA Testing

In 2012, concurrent with the Sorenson/GeneTree purchase, Ancestry began to offer autosomal DNA testing, presumably using Sorenson’s lab, although I have been unable to verify that and Ancestry themselves are very tight lipped about the topic. Given the history of quality and confidence issues, many old-timers in this field were skeptical. We had hoped that perhaps Ancestry had spent enough time and investment up front that they would “get it right” this time. CeCe Moore’s first posting was exciting, and we hoped that once again, one of the companies would set a new standard for everyone to leapfrog to. It didn’t take long to discover that wasn’t the case.

If you haven’t already seen the series of blogs about Ancestry’s quality issues with autosomal testing, take a look at CeCe Moore’s blog postings about Scandinavian admixture and more recently, the horribly discouraging adoption sibling match mixup.

To me, the worst part of this mixup issue isn’t that a mistake was made. It has happened before at other labs, but the difference is that in the other case, the company, 23andMe, stepped right up to the plate, took responsibility, and fixed the issue along with the underlying problem. They didn’t try to make it someone else’s issue or pass the buck…and they were truthful.

In this case, when Ancestry was notified by the customer that an issue existed, apparently Ancestry did not take significant notice of the situation. If there is a link or escalation procedure between the support department and the lab, it apparently wasn’t initiated or didn’t work. After the customers persisted, Ancestry said they would send them a new kit, but it would be about 2 months or so before they got results. Clearly, Ancestry wasn’t concerned that they had an issue within their system someplace…or that 2 months would have shrunk into overnighting kits and an immediate lab run.

Because Ancestry does not allow people to access or download their actual raw data, as does Family Tree DNA and 23andMe, the participants were unable to verify or dispute the findings and had to rely solely on Ancestry’s fatally flawed comparison.

Out of sheer frustration, and a sense of ethics since she had initially encouraged autosomal testing through Ancestry, CeCe Moore then reported what happened on her blog. It took Ancestry another 3 full days to “discover” her post, call her and finally offer an explanation that was, in fact, significantly different than that given to the actual client whom CeCe is working with. Had Ancestry paid attention, it would never have gotten to this point. Had they listened to the customer, it would never have gotten to this point. If they allowed people access to their own data, we would have tools to help these people and it would probably never have gotten to this point. Looks like we don’t have to wonder anymore about Ancestry’s quality controls.

However, we’re not done yet. To add insult to injury, Ancestry then claimed that they discovered this error themselves, through their “quality control procedures.” Really? When did CeCe’s blog become part of Ancestry’s quality control procedure?

Here is their reply on CeCe’s blog.

“AncestryDNA, and the laboratories we work with, take the quality and accuracy of our DNA test very seriously. Through our quality control procedures, we recently discovered that a small number of customers had a problem with their DNA results due to a laboratory error. In the rare case where there is an error, we work directly with our members to correct the results, which in some cases requires a new DNA sample. We have contacted all the individuals affected by this error and are in the process of correcting it. We sincerely apologize for any inconvenience and confusion that can be a result of an error and are working hard to make this right for our members in a timely manner. We appreciate everyone’s patience as we continue to fine-tune this exciting new product.”

Compare the above statement about how important quality is to Ancestry to the following section from their mandatory release that everyone has to sign when they activate the AncestryDNA autosomal DNA kit.

“In addition, we do not make any representations as to the accuracy, comprehensiveness, completeness, quality, currency, error-free nature, compatibility, security or fitness for purpose of the AncestryDNA Website, Content or Service.”

Instead of stepping up to the plate, thanking CeCe for discovering THEIR problem, apologizing and accepting responsibility, Ancestry tried to make this uncomfortable situation CeCe’s fault, saying CeCe should have called them personally instead of blogging, and then misrepresented what happened to cover the ugly truth.

CeCe discusses this phone call in a second blog about this topic. Be sure to read the comments. She is obviously not making any friends at Ancestry, but bless her for being our advocate! David staring up into the face of Goliath.

Consent and Release

In the midst of all of this, we also discovered that, according to Ancestry’s release and consent forms for autosomal DNA testing, that they can aggregate and sell our data. So they can sell our data, including our medical data, but they won’t provide the same raw data to us so we can provide at least a minimal check on their “quality control.” All of a sudden, the low price for the kit and their focus on amassing large amounts of data start to make a little more sense. Who are the customers for purchasing our data? What do they want to do with it?

Ancestry obtains consent by what could be construed as a “shady” practice of positioning the research consent and testing release agreements adjacent, not stating that the research consent is optional and inferring by industry standards that one must click to proceed. The release to sell our data is not optional. And none of this consenting happens when ordering, or prior to ordering, the kit. It happens later, after you’ve paid and received your kit, and there is a $25 charge at that point to cancel the order. Ah yes, the slippery slope.

If you’d like to hear what Dr. Ken Chahine has to say, you can see him testify before the Presidents Commission for the Study of BioEthical Issues. A transcript is here. Dr. Chahine is the senior vice president of Ancestry.com and general manager for Ancestry DNA where he leads the development and commercialization of population genetics. He is also professor of law at the University of Utah and has held various positions in the biotechnology industry including president and CEO of Avigen. He holds a PhD in Biochemistry along with a law degree. In this testimony, he says that Ancestry’s customers own their own data, but then he says the following:

“My thing — what’s interesting from a commercial standpoint is we — a lot of customers get data from either us or from other services. And what I see that’s a little disturbing sometimes is that they upload their data to sites that quite frankly I can’t even have — I try to research who these individuals are that are doing additional research on people’s data. And I’m not even sure who they are or how they’re qualified and if the data that they’re getting back are even, you know, valid, right? So the point is that I think that we are moving in a direction where consumers feel comfortable, rightly or through ignorance, uploading their data to other sites. So I do think that restricting sort of the end I think is important just to be able to take care of that issue.”

Ironic, given Ancestry’s current adoption sibling mixup, that Ken is concerned about “the data they’re getting back are even, you know, valid, right” from other resources, when the information from Ancestry itself isn’t. So apparently Ancestry is being the benevolent parent to all of us, restricting us from having access to our own data, that they say we own, while they retain the right to sell it to others. Hmmm….I smell a rat…or maybe it’s that skunk plant. Ancestry is afraid we might do something “bad” with our data, like, for example, catch their errors.

The True Cost Isn’t $99

And there is more too. It also appears that if your Ancestry subscription expires, that you no longer receive matches that you can contact. If in fact this is accurate, and there is really no way for any of us to test this right now, that was never made apparent when purchasing the kit. Apparently, you will receive the match, but you cannot contact your match unless you subscribe minimally to “Ancestry Connections” which allows limited access to family trees, photos and DNA results for $4.95 per month which equates to $59.40 per year.

So the real cost of the AncestryDNA test isn’t $99, but $99 plus either an Ancestry subscription for $155 per year for the US or $299 for the world or alternately, the cost of Ancestry Connections, $59.40 per year. It’s unclear whether or not if you only subscribe to the US Ancestry package if you only get US matches.

In any event, this subscription requirement was not made apparent up front and it dramatically changes the landscape of the cheap $99 test. It adds strings that weren’t evident up front and if you no longer maintain your subscription in some way, you lose the benefit of your DNA test and any other DNA tests you’ve paid for and are associated with your account. Ouch. How many people would have tested if they knew their results would be held hostage for the price of a subscription? And what happens to those results when you can no longer maintain your subscription? Are they just gone to you forever, but still available for Ancestry to sell and for others to see? Can someone else “adopt” them under their subscription so they can still be available for family members?

In my opinion, this is very ugly and the only benefit to anyone is to Ancestry to be able to extort subscriptions from people who want to maintain access to their DNA results, something they didn’t know they had to do when they purchased the autosomal DNA kits initially. After all, that’s not the way the Yline and mitochondrial results worked, and there was no reason to suspect that autosomal testing would work any differently. This amounts to genetic entrapment.

This is a very different model than at Family Tree DNA where results are available forever with no additional cost, and in perpetuity for the family through either private arrangements (account number and password sharing) or the Beneficiary Assignment on your personal page.

As we unearth the truth, morsel my morsel, I’m sure more information will be forthcoming as people discover what does and does not work, and under what circumstances. But isn’t it sad that we have to do this at all. Whatever happened to being forthright and upfront? I think that is called integrity isn’t it??

How Many Strikes Til You’re OUT???

By now, I’ve lost count of how many strikes Ancestry has. Where is the umpire?

Everyone and every company makes mistakes. But the difference is in how (and if) they handle those errors when they do occur.

Given that Sorenson and Ancestry had the original debacle that ended Ancestry’s early DNA testing foray, and they, together, are having another very similar-feeling debacle in 2012, I have to wonder if history is repeating itself. This difference is that this time, Ancestry is now publicly held and has invested so much money, just considering their initial give-away of 10,000 autosomal kits (about $250-300 market price each, a total of 2.5 to 3 million dollars) to build their database, that they are unlikely to exit. The DNA testing marketplace has too much potential and they have a captive audience of about 2 million subscribers. If every subscriber orders just one test of some type for about $100, that equals 200 million dollars. And corporate profit is about expending as little as possible for as much revenue as possible. Better yet, for Ancestry, DNA is a permanent hook to keep people from letting their subscriptions lapse. The percentage of people who abandon their subscriptions has declined in the past year from from 4 to 3.4%. Perhaps that is part of the reason why they are willing to sell their AncestryDNA product for $99, less than their cost of processing this test, that their two competitors sell for $289 (www.familytreedna.com) and $299 (www.23andme.com), respectively. The other reason, of course, could be that they plan to sell aggregated DNA data.

The thing I find interesting is that at least one individual was at Relative Genetics, at Sorenson/Genetree and is also now at Ancestry. Initially I thought this was a good thing, bringing Ancestry some much needed experience. Now, I’m not so sure. Like I said initially, I don’t really know where there problems lie….I just know they exist and have at some level chronically. On top of this, it seems that things are just never exactly what they seem.

The part of this that I find the most distressing is the positioning – Ancestry experienced a lab error which “they discovered and notified the people”. Not true, at least not in the adoptee’s case. Ancestry couldn’t be bothered to pay attention until CeCe blogged and embarrassed them, and then they distorted the facts. And then they had the audacity to be upset with CeCe. What is wrong with this picture?

Ancestry has positioned themselves to absorb as many DNA results as possible by purchasing other companies and nonprofits, and from the general public entering results into their data base, with little focus on accuracy, and a lot of focus on building their data base and selling kits. They are presuming that most of their customers, being DNA novices, won’t know the difference.

Ancestry has also positioned themselves to sell our results, aggregated, including those we contributed to Sorenson, a nonprofit at that time, but will not release those results to us. I’m referring here to both the Sorenson results and autosomal raw data from the AncestryDNA test.

And whatever happened to all those Genetree people who paid the $39 unlock fee? What about the records they paid to unlock and see? Maybe they just lost all the records and it’s no longer a problem.

This behavior has gone from disheartening to discouraging to disgusting to shady to reprehensible. This is the kind of behavior that eventually will cause this industry to be federally regulated, which will literally drive it out of business. Who would visit a physician to obtain a prescription for genetic genealogy testing? In order to avoid this, it’s important to self-regulate ourselves by bringing pressure for unacceptable behavior to stop.

Call to Action

So, what can we do?

Communicate with Ancestry that their behavior regarding these issues is not acceptable. Neither is their paternalistic attitude on one hand while exploiting their customers on the other. It’s one thing, and bad enough, when dealing with submitted genealogy trees and substandard offshore records translations, but DNA testing must be held to the highest of standards. It is the sacred gift of our ancestors, the ultimate truth. As you are probably aware, Ancestry is encouraging everyone to connect their genealogy trees to their DNA results so they can be populated up the trees. It’s only a matter of time, on the present course, until they have a mess that can’t be unraveled.
If you have taken the AncestryDNA autosomal test, request your raw data results from Ancestry. They think CeCe is a lone renegade voice. She is not. We’re a community. Call them at 800-262-3787 (regular support) 800-958-9124 (DNA support) or click on the “Beta Send Feedback” button at the top right of your DNA page. They have stated that feedback through these avenues, especially the Beta Feedback button, is how they are prioritizing their next steps for DNA. This data is yours and you have a right to have it. Furthermore, you can never verify the accuracy of what they report without it.
Vote with your money and buy either at Family Tree DNA or 23andMe. While both have their advantages and disadvantage, neither the ethics or quality of either of those companies is being called into question. Neither requires a subscription. Family Tree DNA never has.
Tell your friends, family and project members to do the same. Those 2 million subscribers that will potentially order DNA tests are all related to someone.

If Ancestry can’t get it right, then they shouldn’t pollute this industry for the rest of us. I hope they get it right and recover their credibility. I hope I’m wrong about the slippery slope and the flush. But I know I’m not wrong about the skunk-plant.

In the mean-time, I leave you with the saying that’s been on the wall for years at Baskin-Robbins:

“There is hardly anything in the world that someone cannot make a little worse and sell a little cheaper, and the people who consider price alone are that person’s lawful prey.”

______________________________________________________________

Disclosure

Thank you so much.

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Family Tree DNA New YouTube Channel

Posted on August 28, 2012 by Roberta Estes

Family Tree DNA has introduced a new YouTube channel. Take a look at this video – Discover the Journey of You.

If you are active in the Genetic Genealogy community, you’ll see people and names you’ll probably recognize, including yours truly. This was filmed, in part, at the Family Tree DNA sponsored International Conference for Genetic Genealogy in November of 2011.

I want to say congratulations to Lenny Trujillo, one of the people featured in this video. Lenny is one of my clients and made wonderful discoveries beginning with his DNA test. His discoveries have continued as a result of the doors opened by his DNA.

Eventually, Lenny also took the WTY test, and it was through Lenny that we discovered a new, critical, SNP for Native Americans which further identified the Native American haplogroup, Q1a3a.

See what can happen as a result of swabbing…..you can make history for yourself and your family, discover your ancestors and contribute to science that will help others as well.

______________________________________________________________

Disclosure

Thank you so much.

DNA Purchases and Free Transfers

Genealogy Services

Genealogy Research

Legacy Tree Genealogists for genealogy research

Ancestry’s Consent Form for AncestryDNA Autosomal Test

Posted on August 16, 2012 by Roberta Estes

When I ordered my Ancestry autosomal kit, called AncestryDNA, I said that I’d blog my way through the process so you can join me. The kit arrived in about ten days, and then it laid on my desk for the next two weeks, looking at me accusingly every single day, silently nagging me. Today, I capitulated, like I had been meaning to do every single day for the past two weeks.

I opened the kit and followed the instructions to register the kit. Easy enough. Enter the bar code on the vial. That bar code connected the kit with my account at Ancestry, and after I entered the code, I saw this next form as part of the activation process.

They ask for my birth year, which they indicate they use in relationship calculations. That certainly seems kosher, so I entered mine. And no, the year displayed above is not my birth year. I’m pretending just for today:)

I clicked on gender and then I clicked in both the Consent Agreement and the Terms and Conditions boxes. I was just about to click on the “Activate this test” button when that little voice started to speak to me.

Now long ago, I used to ignore that little voice, much to my own detriment. When I was younger, it used to say things to me like “you should do what your mother said.” I hated it. When I was in college, it used to say things like “you really should go home and study statistics rather than have another beer.” I REALLY hated it then. I won’t even tell you what it said when I got engaged the first time. You get the idea.

But that little voice said to me, “Hmmm, that’s odd. Why two things to click?” And having always suffered when I ignore the little voice, I’ve finally learned to pay attention, for the most part.

So I went and clicked on both the “Consent Agreement” and the “Terms and Conditions” links, and was I ever glad that I did.

The words “Consent Agreement” look so benign, especially after working with Family Tree DNA’s consent agreement which is about 2 sentences and very straightforward. This one is anything but, AND, I was mortified to see what I was consenting to, other than what I expected, which was to process my kit for genealogy purposes.

Let me say right here and now that you do NOT have to agree to the Consent Agreement to activate your kit, although it doesn’t say that on this page. And given where this box is placed, it certainly gives the impression that you need to click both these boxes to activate the kit, but you don’t. The word “optional” doesn’t appear. There is also nothing to alert you, on this page, that what you are consenting to is research, not simply consenting for your test to be run. Whoda thought???

I did not agree to the Consent Agreement. I did agree to the Terms and Conditions, which are required, and my kit was activated. I’m betting most people don’t even read this verbiage, and I’m betting Ancestry is counting on that fact. In this techno-world, people have come to expect that you have to “click” to agree to whatever, so they click because they feel they have no other option if they want the product…in this case…to activate the kit which they have aleady purchased. While this is the case for the Terms and Conditions, it’s not for the Consent Agreement, which should really be termed optional.

What You’re Giving Consent For

Unnamed and unidentified research projects that Ancestry can identify so long as they fall under their “Human Genetic Diversity Project.”
Ancestry will be using, and potentially SELLING your DNA results, including MEDICAL and genealogical information.
In the Terms and Conditions, which is required to activate your kit, you are granting them a TRANSFERRABLE LICENSE to any information you put into ancestry, plus your DNA results. See items 4 and 7 in the Terms and Conditions section, below.

Oh yes, and just for grins and giggles, here is what they have to say in section 10 about quality, just in case you were wondering:

The Issue

When I gave consent at 23andMe, I signed something very similar to this. But 23andMe is a company that specializes in health traits and risks. I EXPECT them to be doing research. In fact, they are very up-front about the fact that they are doing this. I WANT them to make advancements in science based on crowd-sourcing.

But Ancestry.com is not 23andMe. Their primary purpose in life is not medical testing or health traits. It’s genealogy and family history. I ordered this test to discover more about my family history, to be matched against others who also took the test, not to make my DNA available outside of that realm.

I had to agree to the Terms and Conditions, so whether I want my DNA and genealogy records to be transferrable to whomever, wherever, whenever, or not, they will be. That is apparently the price of admission to genealogy testing, at least autosomal testing, at Ancestry.com.

When I saw that Ancestry gave away thousands of kits initially, followed by selling several thousand more at $99, I wondered how it was that they could afford to do that when the same test, in essence, was being sold by Family Tree DNA for $289 and by 23andMe for $299. Maybe the verbiage that includes medical information tied to genealogy information and the requirement to give up rights to your information in order to test is part of the reason that they can afford to sell this test for $99. Hmmmm….

Maybe that little voice that was saying to me, “if it sounds too good to be true, it probably is,” is right.

Of course, the next step in the kit activation process are prompts to begin your genealogy tree or to upload your GEDCOM file. If you’re going to take the autosomal test, Ancestry’s matching would be very ineffective without the tester providing genealogy information about themselves. I did enter a few generations, as I wasn’t about to upload my entire GEDCOM file, but I also realize that I’ve forever released the information I entered, including the names of my parents and my birth year, into the great transferrable abyss. The little voice is not happy with me. I’m just not convinced that this is ultimately in my best interest.

Below, Ancestry’s Information and Consent Form as well as their Terms and Conditions are copied directly from their webpage. All verbiage, links, highlighting, etc., from here down, is entirely theirs.

Information and Consent Form

We would like you to be part of a research project. This Consent Form gives you information to help you decide if you would like to participate in the research project to be performed by Ancestry.com DNA, LLC (“AncestryDNA,” “us” or “we”). We believe in being transparent so you can understand this consent form and what we are attempting to accomplish through the research project described below. If you have any questions, please contact us using the information below and feel free to discuss your participation with anyone you choose in order to better understand this research project and your options.

Anyone who is using the AncestryDNA service to find out about their genetic ancestry may also voluntarily participate in this research project. You do not have to be in this research project if you don’t want to.

If you are the parent or guardian of a minor who may wish to participate in this research project, you should talk with your child and go over the information in this form with him/her before you and your child make a decision about whether to participate. Your child does not have to participate if he/she does not want to.

Please read this Consent Form carefully; you should print out a copy and keep it somewhere safe. A copy of it is also always available on our website.

1. What is the research project?

The AncestryDNA’s Human Genetic Diversity Project (“The Project”) will collect, preserve and analyze genetic information, genealogical pedigrees, historical records, surveys, medical and health records and other information (collectively, “Information”) from people all around the world in order to better understand human evolution and migration, population genetics, ethnographic diversity and boundaries, genealogy, and the history of our species. Researchers hope that the Project will be an invaluable genealogic tool for future generations and will engage the interest of a wide range of scholars interested in genealogy, anthropology, evolution, languages, cultures, medicine, and other topics. The Information will not be used for medical purposes in the treatment or diagnosis of any individuals.

This Consent Form is consistent with National Institutes of Health Regulations and Ethical Guidelines and explains:

2. What information will be collected?

The Project will collect genetic, genealogical and health information that has been stripped of any personally identifiable information in order to study the history of our species. Genes are in your cells, and they are what make you different from anyone else. Some genes control things like the color of your hair or eyes. Genetic information includes your genotype that is discovered when AncestryDNA processes your saliva or is otherwise provided by you to AncestryDNA (the “Genetic Information”) when you choose to use the AncestryDNA service. Genealogical information is your pedigree, ethnicity, family history, and other information about you that is either provided by you or is gleaned from publicly available documents on Ancestry.com’s website and other locations (the “Genealogical Information”). Health information includes self-reported information from you such as medical conditions, diseases, other health-related information, personal traits, and other information that is either provided by you or is gleaned from publicly available sources, documents on Ancestry.com’s website and other resources (the “Health Information”).

In all cases for this Project, personally identifiable information about specific study participants (such as name and birth date) is removed from the Information before it is compiled as part of this Project.

The Project will take all of this information (that is already stripped of personally identifiable information) and compile it into a single data summary to minimize the possibility that any individual participant can be identified by any researcher or other individual from the Information.

3. How will the information be used?

Your Information will be combined with others and used to further the Project’s objectives of increasing our understanding of the components that define the history of our species. Discoveries made as a result of this research could be used in the study of genealogy, anthropology, evolution, languages, cultures, medicine, and other topics. In any publication of the studies or results, the genetic, genealogical and health information will be stripped of any personally identifiable information.

4. How do I take part in the Project?

To participate, you need to follow the instructions on our website to submit a Test Kit (i.e., a cheek swab sample).

Once you send your DNA samples to us, you must then register the Test Kit with AncestryDNA. During that process, you will be asked to click “accept” at the end of this Information and Consent Form which will allow AncestryDNA to use your samples and information for this Research Project. You will also be required to read and accept our Terms & Conditions and Privacy Policy.

Study staff may contact you to ask you to complete a questionnaire or to ask you if you are willing to be interviewed.

5. What are the costs and will I receive compensation?

The costs of participating in the Project and having your DNA analyzed are the same as having your DNA analyzed on Ancestry.com and not participating in the Project. You will not be charged for participating in the Project.

You will not get paid for being in this Project. The sample(s) you provide for this genetics Project might benefit AncestryDNA in the future. AncestryDNA will own the results of the research and any subsequent publication of the results. You will remain the owner of the samples you provide. Your samples will be stored until AncestryDNA destroys them.

6. What are the benefits of participating?

Participating in this Project may not benefit you directly. But your participation in this Project will assist scientists to better understand our species, including our shared anthropology and medical and genetic traits. Your individual DNA results will be communicated to you regardless of whether or not you consent to be in this Project, including information about genetic relatives, geographic origin, and ethnicity.

7. Are there any risks to participating?

Presently, there are no known health risks involved in obtaining a DNA sample. Your test results may reveal information about members of your biological family (blood relatives). But there are no physical risks for having your sample and information used in this Project. As in any research study, there is a risk that private personal or health information could be compromised and/or that other means could be used to identify you. But, as described herein, we will not disclose your personally identifiable information except as required by law. Please note that a federal law called the Genetic Information Nondiscrimination Act (GINA) generally makes it illegal for health insurance companies, group health plans, and most employers to discriminate against you based on your genetic information. Be aware that this new law does not protect you against genetic discrimination by companies that sell life insurance, disability insurance, or long-term care insurance. There may also be additional risks to participation that are currently unforeseeable. We do our best to ensure that this does not happen and you should read our Privacy Policy and FAQs for more information.

8. How will you protect my information?

AncestryDNA uses a range of physical, technical, and administrative procedures to protect the privacy of your Health Information, your Genetic Information, and your Genealogical Information. For example, we restrict access to our data center and databases by using industry standard passwords and pass cards, your connections to the AncestryDNA website are encrypted, and all Internet computer servers have firewall protection in place. Although AncestryDNA may collaborate with external third parties, these parties will only have access to pooled information stripped of personal identifying Information. AncestryDNA will never release your individual information without asking for and receiving your explicit authorization to do so, except as required by law, and your identity will not be disclosed by us in any publication of the research. Genetic Information will be segregated from other information and only specifically authorized individuals will have access to the Genetic Information. These measures are described in more detail in the AncestryDNA Privacy Policy.

Be aware that your study records (which include your genetic and other information as described above) will be shared and copied as needed for the Project.

9. Could my participation end without my consent?

AncestryDNA has the ability to terminate the Project in its discretion without your consent. AncestryDNA will protect your Information even after the study is terminated.

10. How do I withdraw from this Project?

Participation in this study is purely voluntary. You can decide not to be in this Project and, at any time, you may choose to withdraw some or all of the Information provided by sending a request to consent@ancestry.com. There will be no penalty to you, and you won’t lose any benefits. AncestryDNA will cease using your Information for the Project as soon as it reasonably can after receipt of your request. Any research using your Information that has been performed or published prior to this date will not be reversed, undone, or withdrawn.

If you choose not to participate in the Project, you will still receive your genetic information (i.e., genetic relationships/matching and ethnicity).

11. Further Information and FAQs.

You can ask questions about this research Project at any time. You can contact AncestryDNA at any time if you have any concerns or complaints or if you have questions about the Project. If you wish to contact us then you can do so as follows;

AncestryDNA Member Services
Memberservices@ancestrydna.com
360 W. 4800 N.
Provo, Utah 84604
801-705-7000 or fax to 801-705-7001

If you have questions about what it means to be in a research study, you can call Quorum Review (a research ethics board that reviews this study) at 888-776-9115 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 888-776-9115 end_of_the_skype_highlighting, or visit the Quorum Review website at www.quorumreview.com.

Ancestry.com DNA, LLC

US Terms and Conditions – Revision as of May 3, 2012

Welcome to AncestryDNA. We offer DNA testing and genealogical analysis to help users discover, preserve, and share their family history. Below are our detailed terms and conditions which you must read and accept before using our services.

These Terms and Conditions apply to users visiting or registering on or after May 3, 2012. For existing Users (as defined below), these Terms and Conditions will be come effective on June 3, 2012. For the previous version of the Terms and Conditions, please click here.

Please note that hyperlinks embedded in these terms and conditions (this “Agreement”) may only be accessed through our website. If you are reviewing this Agreement through mobile devices, you may need to visit the website to use the hyperlinks.

1. Overview

Before using this website, ordering a DNA testing kit or having access to the results of the DNA testing, you must review and accept this Agreement which defines your rights and responsibilities as a user of the website and DNA testing service (“User”) operated by Ancestry.com DNA, LLC (“AncestryDNA” or “we”) and located at AncestryDNA.com or via the section of Ancestry.com’s website located at dna.ancestry.com (the “AncestryDNA Website”). The AncestryDNA Website is operated and services are provided in the United States of America. DNA testing and access to the AncestryDNA Website are governed by this Agreement, which, in turn, is governed by the laws of the State of Utah and the United States. Registering as a User and having DNA tested as a part of this service results in your personal and genetic information being stored and processed in the United States, and you specifically consent to AncestryDNA’s storage and processing the DNA and other personal data you submit. The AncestryDNA Website and services provided herein are intended for adults. If any minor gains access to the AncestryDNA Website, the parent or guardian of that minor will be held strictly responsible for that minor’s actions. If you submit a DNA sample of a minor, you must represent that you are the minor’s parent, legal guardian and/or have explicit permission from the minor’s parent or legal guardian. If you do not agree with any provision of this Agreement, or if you have any objections to the AncestryDNA Privacy Statement, you must not use the AncestryDNA Website or be a User.

2. Description of Service

AncestryDNA is part of the Ancestry family of websites, which includes, among others, ancestry.com, rootsweb.com, and familytreemaker.com, as well as international websites such as ancestry.co.uk, ancestry.de, ancestry.fr, ancestry.it, ancestry.se. AncestryDNA offers both a DNA test to help discover your ancestors and an online service where Users view the results of their DNA test (together the “Service”). The AncestryDNA Service can be used in conjunction with the Ancestry family of websites to enable Users to discover, research, and save family history by searching extensive databases of records on www.ancestry.com’s website (or through certain other websites in the Ancestry family of websites) and by utilizing Ancestry.com’s family tree services. AncestryDNA Users and users of the Ancestry family of websites may also communicate with each other in order to collaborate and exchange family history related information (the “Ancestry.com Community”).

3. Limited Use License

The AncestryDNA Website contains graphics, information, data, user generated information, editorial and other content accessible by users (the “Content”). All Content is owned, licensed to and/or copyrighted by AncestryDNA and may be used only in accordance with this limited use license. The AncestryDNA Website is protected by copyright as a collective work and/or compilation, pursuant to U.S. copyright laws, international conventions, and other copyright laws. You may use the Service, access the Ancestry Website, use the graphics, information, data, editorial and other Content only for personal or professional family history research. Republication or resale of any of the Content or other protected data is prohibited. You may use the software provided on the AncestryDNA Website only while online and may not download, copy, reuse or distribute that software, except where it is clearly stated that such software is made available for offline use. AncestryDNA and its licensors retain title, ownership and all other rights and interests in and to all information and Content on the AncestryDNA Website. Bots, crawlers, spiders, data miners, scraping and any other automatic access tool are expressly prohibited. Violation of this limited use license may result in immediate termination of your membership and may result in legal action against you.

Each of the Ancestry family of websites is subject to terms and conditions different from those found here and it is your responsibility to ensure that you have read and understood them before using those websites.

4. DNA Testing

All DNA testing performed by AncestryDNA on samples submitted for testing or by uploading a digital version of a DNA analysis is done for genealogical research only, including population and ethnic group-related analyses, and not for individual medical or diagnostic purposes. Before providing a DNA sample for testing, you represent that you are eighteen (18) years of age or older. In addition, you represent that any sample you provide is either your DNA or the DNA of a person for whom you are a legal guardian or have obtained legal authorization to provide their DNA to AncestryDNA. By submitting DNA samples to AncestryDNA, you give permission to AncestryDNA to extract the DNA from the samples, perform genetic tests on the DNA using test methods available now and developed in the future, to disclose the results of the tests performed to you and others that you authorize, to store the samples for additional genetic testing and archiving purposes, and to store the results of the DNA tests in accordance with this Agreement and with the AncestryDNA Privacy Statement. Any DNA sample submitted to us cannot be returned and shall be stored by AncestryDNA or its agents. AncestryDNA does not claim any ownership rights in the DNA that is submitted for testing. Any genetic information derived from the DNA continues to belong to the person who submitted the DNA sample, subject only to the rights granted to AncestryDNA in this Agreement. In addition, you understand that by providing any DNA to us, you acquire no rights in any research or commercial products that may be developed by AncestryDNA that may relate to or otherwise embody your DNA.

By submitting DNA to AncestryDNA, you grant AncestryDNA a transferable license to use your DNA, and any DNA you submit for any person from whom you obtained legal authorization as described in this Agreement, and to use, host, sublicense and distribute the resulting analysis to the extent and in the form or context we deem appropriate on or through any media or medium and with any technology or devices now known or hereafter developed or discovered. You hereby release AncestryDNA from any and all claims, liens, demands, actions or suits in connection with the DNA sample, the test or results thereof, including, without limitation, errors, omissions, claims for defamation, invasion of privacy, right of publicity, emotional distress or economic loss. See indemnification provision below.

If you are a User residing outside the United States and providing a DNA sample, you confirm that this submission is not subject to any export ban or restriction in the country in which you reside. You also agree that you have the authority, under the laws of the state or jurisdiction in which you reside, to provide the representations in this Agreement and you explicitly waive any laws or regulations relating to DNA testing and storage from the state or jurisdiction in which you reside. You agree that the sample will be tested and stored in the United States as provided in this Agreement. You further agree that you may only be accessible through the AncestryDNA Website and that you may not be able to use the results in a website targeted to your country of residence or hosted outside the United States.

5. Rules of Conduct

Before using the AncestryDNA Website, you agree to comply with all applicable laws and refrain from infringing any third-party rights or interests (for example, privacy and intellectual property rights). You must also agree that you will provide valid and complete contact information, and that you will always have a valid email address on file with AncestryDNA. In addition, the following policies are part of this Agreement and must be followed anytime you access the AncestryDNA Website:

A. You must not post or publish any information that you know is false or misleading, such as impersonating any person or entity, falsely misrepresenting your affiliation with any person or entity, falsely claiming an endorsement that you do not have, or misrepresenting that you are an employee or representative of AncestryDNA or otherwise affiliated with AncestryDNA.

B. You must not reproduce, copy or sell any portion of AncestryDNA or AncestryDNA database contents or systematically download the Content and data of the AncestryDNA database to make or populate another database or for any other purpose.

C. You must not interfere or attempt to interfere with the AncestryDNA Website in any manner. For example, you may not use any software program, virus or routine to block, obscure, overwrite or modify any Content or web pages or to destroy the software, hardware or telecommunications equipment of the AncestryDNA Website or another person.

D. You must not use the information from the AncestryDNA website or DNA tests in whole or in part for any discrimatory or otherwise illegal activity (for example, to make insurance or employment decisions).

These Rules of Conduct are not exclusive. If we believe, in our sole discretion, that you are in breach of this Agreement, are acting inconsistently with the letter or spirit of this Agreement or otherwise interfering with the efficient management or delivery of the AncestryDNA Website, Service or Content, we may limit, suspend or terminate your access to our AncestryDNA Website. In such a case, no portion of your subscription payment will be refunded. Should we decide to suspend or terminate your access for any reason other than your actions or omissions which we believe to be inconsistent with this Agreement we will refund to you any unused portion of your payment, which will be your sole and exclusive remedy upon such a suspension.

6. AncestryDNA Fees and Payments

Users of the AncestryDNA Website may be unregistered visitors or paying members. The different payment options and services offered will be published on the AncestryDNA Website or at the time a DNA test or other service is offered. The terms and conditions applying to such items or services will be incorporated into this Agreement.

You must be 18 years or older to order the AncestryDNA Service. You must provide AncestryDNA with accurate, complete, and up-to-date registration information. Failure to do so will constitute a breach of this Agreement.

Cancellations and Refunds Cancellations may be made by calling AncestryDNA at 1-800-958-9124 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 1-800-958-9124 end_of_the_skype_highlighting and providing the same information that you provided when you ordered your AncestryDNA Service. If you cancel within the first 30 days of placing your order, and before you returned a DNA sample to AncestryDNA, you will receive a refund equal to the price paid for the AncestryDNA Service minus $25. If you cancel within the first 30 days of placing your order but after you have returned a DNA sample to AncestryDNA, you will receive a partial refund equal to one half of the price paid for the AncestryDNA Service. AncestryDNA does not refund shipping & processing charges or any applicable taxes paid. Your credit will be provided via the credit card you used to purchase the AncestryDNA Service. Please allow a reasonable time for the credit to reach you.

Replacement Testing Kits Should you require a replacement DNA testing kit, you may call AncestryDNA at 1-800-958-9124 begin_of_the_skype_highlighting 1-800-958-9124 end_of_the_skype_highlighting and providing the same information that you provided when you ordered your AncestryDNA test. Replacement kits are $25 per kit (plus applicable shipping and handling).

Prices Subject to Change. Prices may be changed by AncestryDNA at any time.

7. User Provided Content

Portions of the AncestryDNA Website allow you and other Users to contribute material to be displayed on the AncestryDNA Website (“User Provided Content”). For User Provided Content, AncestryDNA is merely hosting and providing access. We cannot, and expressly do not, accept any liability with regard to such User Provided Content (including with respect to its accuracy). While we cannot preview or monitor User Provided Content, we may apply, at our discretion, automated filtering tools to monitor and/or delete any content that AncestryDNA believes to be in violation of this Agreement. We reserve the right to act expeditiously to remove or disable access to any User Provided Content that we believe violates this Agreement. We are also sensitive to the copyright and other intellectual property rights of others. For complaints regarding copyright infringement, illegal or inappropriate content, click here.

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Y DNA – Family Tree DNA vs Ancestry

Posted on August 14, 2012 by Roberta Estes

I’m regularly asked about a comparison between the Y DNA products of Family Tree DNA and Ancestry.com.

Update: Ancestry no longer has Y DNA testing, but Family Tree DNA does and this article still provides a good overview.

The price changes periodically at both companies, and as far as I’m concerned, the more compelling purchase criteria are features and functions, not price. The prices are usually relatively close.

Marker Results

At Family Tree DNA and at Ancestry, marker results are displayed for the person who tested. Ancestry tests either 33 or 46 markers. Family Tree DNA tests 12, 25, 37, 67 or 111 markers.

Family Tree DNA results are above. Ancestry, below.

Haplogroup Maps

At Ancestry, the map, haplogroup description and results are all on one page, shown above, while at Family Tree DNA, they are displayed on separate pages. At Family Tree DNA, the map is interactive.

A second Haplogroup tab at Family Tree DNA also provides frequencies worldwide for the haplogroup. Ancestry doesn’t provide anything similar.

Frequency Map

Matches

Both companies, of course, provide a list of matches.

At Family Tree DNA, above, your matches have real e-mail addresses that you access by clicking on the little envelope. You don’t have to contact them through a messaging system. The TIP calculations provide time to the Most Recent Common Ancestor and allows you to modify that calculation with known genealogical information. We discussed the MRCA function and compared the calculations between Family Tree DNA and Ancestry in the blog posting, “What Does MCRA Really Mean?”.

One of the must useful features is the Most Distant Ancestor field, which allows you to see at a glance if any of these matches share an ancestor with you, or in the geography of your ancestors.

Family Tree DNA has a privacy option, which allows your match to be shown, but no details. You can directly attach a Gedcom file that is available only to your matches.

At Ancestry, your actual marker values are displayed compared with people you match, so you can see which markers you do and don’t match. Non-matches are highlighted. However, not all markers are displayed on the page. You have to scroll right at the bottom of the page to see the rest. All people at Ancestry are encouraged to upload thier family tree, and attach their results to the tree. That tree then becomes a part of Ancestry.com, although you can make it private.

Haplogroups are not displayed and neither are SNPs because Ancestry doesn’t test SNPs. This means that they estimate all of their haplogroups, and occasionally incorrectly. Complex haplogroup names, such as R1b1a2a1a1a4, mean those results have been hand entered by someone who tested elsewhere. Ancestry can’t estimate to that level.

Manual Entry Issues at Ancestry

Furthermore, the results displayed, when entered by hand by people who tested at other companies often contain “clerical mutations,” otherwise known at typos. This is the old GIGO concept – Garbage In, Garbage Out. People identified with an asterisk have entered their results by hand, including a haplogroup name.

There are 4 markers that must be adjusted at Ancestry for Family Tree DNA results to be equivalent to the same markers at Ancestry. In other words, the two companies “score” these markers differently. Initially, you had to know this and compensate. Then, Ancestry changed and began to do the compensation for you when you enter the results. That was a definite improvement, but the result is that you have no idea if the results you are looking at are equalized or not. The message here is that if you see an “*”, know to beware.

Furthermore, you can only have one set of results attached to your account, at least if you hand enter, and therefore if you want to check on matches for different relatives in your family, you need to edit the results from one person’s results to another. In this case, you must do the compensation math on the markers yourself. Fortunately, the list of markers is on the edit page, assuming people read, understand what to do and remember to adjust those values.

Advanced Matching

Family Tree DNA, in their last major update, added an advanced matching feature across their products that includes surname, partial name, project and combined tests matching. This is an extremely powerful tool. Ancestry has nothing similar.

Haplotrees

Family Tree DNA provides a haplotree. Ancestry doesn’t test SNPs, so they have nothing to put on a haplotree. Family Tree DNA guarantees that if they can’t predict your haplogroup by an exact match at 12 markers to another individual who has been SNP tested, that they will SNP test, for free, until they can successfully tell you at least which base haplogroup you are a member of. This test is called the Backbone test. They seldom need to do this anymore, but I do still occasionally see the Backbone test where the individual’s marker values are very unusual.

You can tell that Ancestry has spent a lot of time making their user interface very friendly, and it is. Some would refer to this as “dumbed down,” but regardless, haplotrees, SNPs, changing haplogroup names and all of that tends to be confusing, certainly to the novice. Most of Ancestry’s customers fall into the novice category. Ancestry’s marketing is directed at the impulse “feel good” purchase. They do a good job catering to that marketspace and that group of consumers doesn’t have any idea what a SNP is, or that there is anything more than what Ancestry provides them.

Ancestry doesn’t have a haplotree and their customers don’t miss it, at least not until someone who has tested at Family Tree DNA gets ahold of them, they need something more or want to join a project at Family Tree DNA. Fortunately, now Family Tree DNA does provide an option for Ancestry customers to “transfer in” for a reduced fee.

Haplogroup Origins

Haplogroup Origins is very powerful tool provided by Family Tree DNA and often overlooked. Haplogroup origins are haplogroup matches, based on STR markers, that point the direction to where your ancestors lived before surnames. This is invaluable in determining general locations for people trying to find their ancestors in Europe.

Ancestral Origins

Ancestral Origins is another extremely powerful tool provided by Family Tree DNA that is similar to haplogroup origins, but brings the match time closer to the present. These are the locations of the oldest ancestors of people that match you on STR markers, not based on your haplogroup. Again, extremely useful for people trying to find their ancestor’s location overseas and/or trying to verify a particular ethnicity, such as Jewish.

Matches Maps

Both Ancestry and Family Tree DNA offer a map of matches, but they are significantly different.

At Ancestry, the matches shown on the map are the current addresses of the people who tested, NOT their oldest ancestor. Personally, I find this a bit creepy, as I really don’t want someone knowing where I live. Having said that, it’s a wonderful tool for adoptees and I use this feature constantly looking for location matches for my adoptee clients. Most recently, I found someone’s closest match genetically in the city where they were born. That’s a big clue. Matches are sorted in closest to furthest order and you can click on either the person icon or the name and see additional information on the map, such as the location, the name and how close the match is.

At Family Tree DNA, the matches shown are the locations of the oldest ancestors of the people you match. This is really much more relevant to genealogists in general. In addition, a match list can be displayed, and by clicking on either the person’s name, or a balloon, additional information is displayed including an e-mail option. This is an extremely powerful tool for someone looking for geographic matches or trying to determine which matches to contact.

SNP Map

Family Tree DNA has a new SNP mapping feature. Of course, Ancestry doesn’t have this, because they don’t test SNPs. This new mapping feature allows you to map clusters of SNPS. I selected clusters of 10 of R1a1-M198 just as an example.

This can be beneficial in tracking groups of haplogroup ancestors. As haplogroups connect with more modern times, this tool will become more powerful and useful to the typical genealogist.

Print Certificates and Maps

Family Tree DNA has a print option for certificates and maps. While this isn’t particularly important to me, it is to many.

Projects

At Family Tree DNA, aside from personal matches, much of the power of matching comes through projects. Volunteer administrators lovingly manage these and many, many discoveries have been made through projects.

Family Tree DNA provides oversight so that projects aren’t created willy-nilly, and projects fall into 3 main categories, surname, haplogroup and geographic projects.

Surname projects are obvious, as are haplogroup projects. Occasionally there are multiples in these categories. For example, there is a Miller project and then I have a Miller-Brethren project for the Miller families who were of the Brethren faith.

Haplogroup projects often have subgroups studying particular SNPs or large subgroups, such as haplogroup E1b1a (Sub-Saharan Africa) and E1b1b (North Africa/Mediterranean), which are different projects.

Geographic projects are pretty much anything else. My Cumberland Gap projects are there, both y-line and mitochondrial DNA, the Lost Colony projects, the Acadian project, Native American projects, the Bahamas and Puerto Rican projects, and many more. Many times academic researchers and population geneticists work with these project administrators.

Projects are absolutely wonderful resources providing the opportunity to work with others who have similar interests to learn more about the people within your group. For example, the Cumberland Gap group has provided a venue for genetic matching within the region, but we also offer a Yahoo group for project members where we share cultural and historical aspects of the Cumberland Gap area as well as genealogy.

While it is beyond the scope of this Y DNA comparison, Family Tree DNA also provides many tools to project administrators.

Family Tree DNA provides a search feature for projects that includes key words and surnames, plus an alphabetical browse, by category, shown above. They also display a list of projects that include the surname of the person who is signed on and doing the search. I was signed on when I did the above search, and you can see that there are 4 projects that include the surname Estes in their project profile, Estes, Jester and the Cumberland Gap Y-line and mitochondrial DNA projects.

In addition, Family Tree DNA provides a public webpage for every project that includes participant grouping capabilities, shown below, colorized matches within groups, and mapping.

Project maps can display the oldest ancestor location of an entire project or of any selected subgroup.

This is a very powerful tool, especially in relation to haplogroup maps.

At Ancestry, shown below, you can search for either groups or individual surnames. The surname search is a useful tool. I searched for Estes. I can see that people by that surname have tested and their haplogroup, but I can’t see their results. Of course, if I enter Estes marker results, by process of elimination, I can figure out who I do and don’t match from this list. To contact these people, I have to go through Ancestry’s message service. My experience has been that few Ancestry contact requests are successful.

Unfortunately, at Ancestry, everyone is encouraged to “create a group.” Anyone can join whether they have DNA tested or not. It doesn’t matter if their DNA test is for a genealogy line relevant to the project, meaning paternal or direct maternal, and there is no oversight ability or control. In essence, these are individual or family study groups, not DNA projects, per se.

I entered the surname Moore, one of my brick walls. The number of “Moore” groups was overwhelming. It’s clear from looking at these that many people have created what I would term personal family study groups, but sorting through them and trying to find something useful is overwhelming. There were 25 groups including several who were listed as the Moore Paternal surname group, with 1, 2 or 3 participants in each. The oversight provided at Family Tree DNA avoids this type of mess.

Compare this to the projects at Family Tree DNA that list the surname Moore. Additionally, Family Tree DNA tells me that 824 people with the surname of Moore have tested. Of those, 454 are in the Moore Worldwide project. Yep, if I’m a male Moore, that’s where I’d want to be – where I can compare to other Moore lines.

Other Resources

On the Other Resources tab, Family Tree DNA has a list of several other resources, all free. In addition, you can download a free e-book about how to interpret your results, or you can order a customized Personal DNA Report. None of these additional items are available at Ancestry.

Populating DNA up Trees

One feature that Ancestry has that Family Tree DNA does not is the ability to populate the DNA up a tree. Obvious pitfalls are twofold. First, the DNA may not be relevant to people up the tree if a nonparental event has occurred, also known as an undocumented adoption.

Second, the genealogy may not be correct and you’ve just genetically populated the wrong people. Not everyone views this “tree population” as a positive feature. Many view this with a very high level of trepidation, understanding that the many incorrect trees at Ancestry will eventually also have incorrect genetic information as part of that family record. There is also concern that in time, this will actually discourage DNA testing because people will find these DNA populated trees and believe that their line has already been tested, so they will think they don’t need to test.

Comparison Chart

As an easy comparison, I’ve created the following chart to compare the Y-line DNA testing and products.

Feature	Family Tree DNA	Ancestry
Marker Results	Yes, 12, 25, 36, 67 or 111 markers	Yes, 33 or 46 markers
Migration Map	Yes – interactive	Yes
Haplogroup Description	Yes	Yes
Haplogroup Frequency Map	Yes	No
SNP testing	Yes, Individual SNPs, Deep Clade and Geno 2.0	No
Matching	Yes, most distant ancestor listed, direct e-mail	Yes, marker comparison provided
Haplotree	Yes, includes free SNP Backbone test if haplogroup cannot be predicted	No
Advanced Matching	Yes, by surname, partial name, project and varying test combinations	No, but does have general surname search for participants
Ancestral Origins	Yes	No
Haplogroup Origins	Yes	No
Matches Map	Yes, location of oldest ancestors	Yes, location of person who took the test
SNP Map	Yes	No
Print Certificates and Maps	Yes	No
Projects	Yes, tools and oversight provided, surname, haplogroup and geographic, includes web page, groups and maps	Yes, encourages everyone to create project, lack of organization and tools
Additional Resources	Personal DNA Reports, free e-book, Multiple FAQs, Forum, Newsletter, Genographic Project, Glossary, Ysearch, Mitosearch, News, Release Notes, Academic papers, Annual Administrator’s Conference, Mitochondrial DNA testing (full sequence), Autosomal DNA testing (with data download), Walk the Y (WTY)	General FAQ, Mitochondrial DNA testing (no full sequence), Autosomal DNA testing (no data download), normal Ancestry subscription services, “ability” to populate DNA up trees

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What Does MCRA (MRCA) Really Mean??

Posted on August 6, 2012 by Roberta Estes

The MCRA or time to the Most Recent Common Ancestor is a calculation provided by both Family Tree DNA and Ancestry.com for their clients who have taken the Y-line DNA tests. This is also written MRCA, Most Recent Common Ancestor, MCA and all of the above prefaced with a T meaning “time to”. Regardless of which way you see this acronym, it means the same thing – the closest ancestor you share with someone in the DNA line being tested.

I have a great example of how this actually translates into reality using the results from both companies.

Often, I receive communications from people who say something like this:

“It says that I’m related to John Doe within 6 generations. I have both of our genealogies to 6 generations, and I can’t find our common ancestor. What is wrong?”

The answer to “What is wrong?” is easy. The person doesn’t understand what the tool that estimates MCRA is telling them. And, I’m betting they didn’t read the instructions and explanations either, that is if they tested at Family Tree DNA who provides such.

Family Tree DNA provides a great deal more information and a far more robust tool than Ancestry. Family Tree DNA begins with this information:

“The probability that John Doe and William Doe shared a common ancestor within the last X generations…” The number of generations and the percentage probability are shown below.

You can also change the generational display. I changed mine to “every generation.”

This is followed by an explanation and instructions for how to refine the calculations:

Refine your results with paper trail input

However, these results can be refined if their paper trail indicates that no common ancestor between John Doe and William Doe could have lived in a certain number of past generations.

If you don’t know this information for a fact, do not change the “1” in the box in the next paragraph. However, if you have the information, please enter in the box and click on the recalculate button.

John Doe and William Doe did not share a common ancestor more recently than 1 generation(s). (Because the important factor in calculating the time to the Most Recent Common Ancestor is the number of generations between which mutations could take place, the number of years per generation is irrelevant in FTDNATiP™ calculations).

After that, additional explanation and a reference to a FAQ sheet:

* The FTDNATiP™ results are based on the mutation rate study presented during the 1st International Conference on Genetic Genealogy, on Oct. 30, 2004. The above probabilities take into consideration the mutation rates for each individual marker being compared.

Since each marker has a different mutation rate, identical Genetic Distances will not necessarily yield the same probabilities. In other words, even though John Doe has a Genetic Distance‡ of 4 from William Doe, someone else with the same Genetic Distance may have different probabilities, because the distance of 4 was prompted by mutations in different markers, with different mutation rates.

‡Note: The Genetic Distance is the count of the total difference between two individuals. For example, if a marker differs by 2, then the Genetic Distance will count this as a distance of 2.

More questions? Please refer to the FTDNATiP™ FAQ page.

This is a huge difference compared to Ancestry who only gives you a number with absolutely no explanation at all:

The MCRA is the small number beside the name – so John Doe is an MCRA of 2 and William is 24. I have highlighted these in red below so that you can see them.

Here is the explanation the Ancestry which is followed by the match table.

“You could be close to a meaningful family connection! The list below is sorted by how close your DNA matches (MRCA). The closest matches are at the top.”

Real Life Example

Ok, but what does all this really mean, in real life, to me?

Fortunately, I have a client who has tested at both locations, and has another man who he matches both at Ancestry and at Family Tree DNA. In addition, we know who their common ancestor is, and we can use this information to compare the accuracy and usefulness of the MCRA calculations.

At Ancestry, these men have tested 34 markers in common and have 4 mutations difference. Ancestry calls this relationship a distant match at 24 generations to the most common recent ancestor (MCRA).

At Family Tree DNA, they have tested 37 markers in common and have 4 mutations. Family Tree DNA, without refining the MCRA with the paper trail, calls this as the 50th percentile at 11 generations. This means that there is a 50% chance that you have a common ancestor within 11 generations. I use the 50th percentile number because that is the “most likely” spot – meaning that it’s equally likely that your ancestor was closer generationally or further away.

We know that these men are at 8 generations to a common ancestor for one man and 7 generations for the other.

Checking Family Tree DNA’s chart for 7 and 8 generations, that percentage or probability is 20% and 27% respectively.

Interestingly enough, Family Tree DNA says that at 24 generations, which was Ancestry’s estimated number of generations, there is a 97+% likihood that indeed they have a common ancestor.

So what we’ve learned is that Ancestry, aside from providing no tools or explanation, is very, very conservative. In this case, the number they give you is more likely their 100% sure number, not their “most likely” 50th percentile number. In fact, if we divide their number in half, it’s still high.

We’ve learned that Family Tree DNA’s 50th percentile is much closer to reality, even without any tweaking that you can do based on known pedigree charts.

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Jewish Voice Interview with Bennett Greenspan

Posted on August 2, 2012 by Roberta Estes

Bennett Greenspan recently appeared on Jewish Voice. He gave a wonderful interview that addressed far more than Jewish interests. He speaks about Jewish ancestry and testing, population genetics, autosomal DNA testing and sample populations. There are also great shots of sequencing equipment and other DNA test paraphernalia. And love the tie:)

This is an excellent basics primer that everyone can understand. The consummate “elevator pitch.” Genetic genealogy isn’t that easy to explain, but he did a great job. Granted, he did have a little more time than an elevator ride.

Always the businessman, Bennett brought the host, Rabbi Jonathan Bernis, a test kit and he swabbed on the show as well! Enjoy!

http://www.itbn.org/index/detail/lib/Networks/sublib/TBN/ec/VsYWNlNTrw98zu18Se-C_nktOBEq4fVY