I can’t believe how often I receive this question.
Here’s today’s version from Patrick.
“My mother had 1/8 Indian and my grandmother on my father’s side was 3/4, and my grandfather on my father’s side had 2/3. How much would that make me?”
First, this question was about Native American ancestry, but it could just have easily have been about African, European, Asian, Jewish….fill in the blank.
Secondly, Patrick’s initial question is a math question, but the real question is how much of a particular ethnicity do you have on paper versus how much you have genetically.
How could they be different?
Lots of ways.
Oral history in families tends to get diluted and condensed over time. For example, maybe grandmother wasn’t really 3/4th – because her ancestors were admixed and she (or her descendants) didn’t know it. And how does one have 2/3, exactly, with 4 grandparents. So, the story may not be the whole story.
For our example, we’re going to eliminate the 2/3 number, because it can’t be correct. A grandparent would be 1/4th, a great grandparent, 1/8th. In other words, ancestors fractions come in divisions of 4, or 2, but not 3 – because it takes 2 people in each generation.
So, you could have 3 of 4 ancestors who are native, which would make the person 3/4th, 2 of 4 which would make the person half, or 1 of 4 which would make the person one quarter, but you cannot have 1 of 3, 2 of 3 or 3 of 3, because you have 4 grandparents, not 3.
First, let’s answer the math question.
Math is your friend.
There are three easy steps.
1. Divide Each Generation By Half to Current
Each ancestral generation is reduced by one half, because the DNA is diluted by half in each generation.
So, if Patrick’s mother is 1/8, Patrick is 1/16 on their mother’s side, because Patrick received half of her DNA. With fractions, you can’t reduce the top number of 1 by one half so you double the bottom number.
If grandfather was 3/4, then father was 3/8 on that side and Patrick is 3/16th.
So, now, add the numbers for Patrick together.
2. Find the Common Denominator
The two numbers you need to add together from the above exmaple are 1/16 and 3/16. This is easy because the denominator is already the same – 16. But let’s say you also have a third number, just for purposes of example. Let’s say that third number is 3/32.
How do you add 1/16, 3/16 and 3/32?
The denominator has to be the same. If you look at the denominators, you’ll see that if you double the fractions with 16, they become fractions with 32 as their denominator.
So, for this example, 1/16 becomes 2/32, 3/16 becomes 6/32 and 3/32 remains the same.
3. Add the Top Numbers Together
Now just add the numerators, or the top numbers together.
2/32 + 6/32 + 3/32 = 11/32
That’s the answer. In this example, our person, per their family history, is 11/32 Native or 34.38%.
Patrick, who originally asked the question is 1/16 + 3/16 which equals 4/16, which reduces to 1/4 (by dividing the same number, 4, into the top and bottom of the fraction), plus whatever amount that “2/3” really is. So, Patrick is more than one quarter, at least on paper.
The next question is often, “how do I prove that?” In terms of Native ancestry, the answer varies on the purpose – general interest, tribal identification or tribal membership, etc. I’ve written about that in two articles, here and here.
You can take a DNA test from Family Tree DNA called Family Finder that provides you with percentages of ethnicity, including Native American, as well as a list of cousin matches. They also offer additional testing that may be relevant if you descend from the native person paternally (if you are a male) or matrilineally (for both sexes.)
On the diagram below, you can see the Y DNA in blue, inherited by males from their father and the mitochondrial or matrilineal DNA in red, always inherited from the mother. While the Y and mitochondrial tests give you very specific information on two lines, the Family Finder test provides you with ethnicity information from all of your lines. It just can’t tell you which line or lines the Native heritage came from.
Often, due to admixture in the Native population over the past several hundred years, since the Europeans “discovered” America, the amount of Native DNA is less than expected and sometimes is so far back and such a small amount that it doesn’t show at all.
An individual could well be considered a full tribal member, yet have less than half Native heritage. Examples that come to mind are Mary Jemison, an adopted captive who was European, but considered a full tribal member, and Sequoyah, who invented the Cherokee alphabet. Even the Cherokee Chief, Benge was at least half European, sporting red hair. His mother was a member of the Cherokee tribe, so Benge was as well. Cherokee Chief John Ross, born in 1790, was only one eighth Native.
So, the bottom line. Enjoy your family history and heritage. Document your family stories. Understand that tribal membership was historically not a matter of percentages, at least not until the late 1800s and early 1900s. Your ancestor either was or was not “Indian,” generally based on the tribal membership status of their mother. There was no halfway and mixed didn’t matter.
DNA testing can confirm Native heritage. It can also prove Native heritage in a variety of ways depending on how one descends from the Native ancestor(s), using Y and mitochondrial DNA. Depending on whether Patrick is male or female, and how Patrick descends from his or her Native ancestors, the Y or mitochondrial DNA test can add a wealth of information to Patrick’s family history.
For some people, DNA testing is how one discovers that they have a Native ancestor.
So, how much Indian do you have in you, on paper and through DNA testing?
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I came out 25% native American.
Great concise well stated article. Sound like a few people just want someone to do the work for them.
Iam .6 native american,, was always told my great great grandmother was choctaw, now not sure if it was her or her parents,,, she susposedly was removed from tribe when she married an irish man,,,but her mother married an english man,,,
I had my DNA done. And the results was that I’m 56% European. I have always been told I’m part Cherokee. Can you help me figure this out, please.
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I had my DNA done and it did not show any Native American. I am 1/16 (6.25%) Cherokee. From what I have read on DNA websites, Native American DNA is inconclusive. History says that Native Americans originally came from Asian countries. When I looked at my DNA results I have 9% Asian DNA. So, take a look at your DNA results and see if you have any DNA from Asian countries. I hope this helps.
I’ve always been told I had Cherokee on my dad’s side. I took a DNA test and it shows 13.6% from west asia. So how much does that make me?
West Asia is not affiliated with Native American.
Yes Roberta it is….”Nearly one-third of Native American genes come from west Eurasian people linked to the Middle East and Europe, rather than entirely from East Asians as previously thought, according to a newly sequenced genome”
This is from this article: https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2013/11/131120-science-native-american-people-migration-siberia-genetics/
You are misinterpreting this article. If you have no Native today and only western Asian, it does not reflect Native heritage.
What about this?
NOTE: Since Native Americans originally migrated from Asia, you may instead see a percentage marked “Asian.” Unless you have recent Asian ancestry in your family tree, that probably reflects Native American ancestry.
I have all of the physical characteristics of being Cherokee and I am trying to find out about it since I wasn’t close to that side of the family. I know that there was a cherokee woman on my dad’s side that went by “Goldie”. That’s why I did the myheritage DNA test. Apparently some of the native genes don’t always show up on the DNA tests:
“In addition, though you might have Native American DNA, it might belong to a tribe that is not part of the sampling used to build our Ethnicity Estimate. There are more than 500 recognized tribes which are ethnically, culturally and linguistically diverse. However the majority of these tribes have not contributed their DNA for research purposes which would allow science to establish better ethnicity models. Therefore, the fact that we did not find Native American DNA in your sample does not mean that you are not Native American.”
There are a lot of educational Native American resources here: https://dna-explained.com/2017/11/01/native-american-dna-resources/
I also had a DNA test done that didn’t show any Native American lineage. I know that my 4th Great Grandmother was 100% Cherokee. Her maiden name was Rebecca Hawk and married William Holland. A son Archibald Holland begat Harrison Ramsey Holland. Harrrison Ramsy begat Ed Holland. Ed begat Lena Holland who was my Grandmother. If my math is correct I’m 1/64 or 1.562% Native American.
I was told by one genealogist that some well known DNA test show these small amounts of Native American as Eastern European.
No, the tests do not show Native as Eastern European. Your ancestor was likely already admixed by the time you found them on the rolls. Today’s article about Elizabeth Warren is one that might help you to read.
You were lied to
It happens ALL the time in families. My grandma tried to convince me when I was around 5 or 6 that we were distant relatives of dolly Parton.
What I can’t wrap my brain around is how if both parents are 50% native american their children are only 25%… if one was 100% and one was 0% then the kids would be 50%. why is it so different??
No, if both parents are 50%, then the child is 50% too. Here’s the match. Divide the percent carried by each parent in half. So, each parent contributes 25% Native DNA to the child. Then add the percentages from both parents contribution together – so you’re back at 50%. This is because there is some from both parents, not just one.
That makes far more sense. I guess the family history papers I have must be messed up somewhere 🙁
My grandmother on my father’s side was full-blooded Native American how do I find out if I have Indian in my blood?
My great-grandmother on my father’s side was supposed to have been full blooded Cherokee. I had my Dna done at ancestry and there was no native American showed up. Should I be looking for something else there or should I do another test?
She certainly wasn’t full blooded. Check the tribal rolls.
My husbands, Maternal grandfather, full Cherokee,Maternal grandmother 1/4 Choctah. “I’m told” how do I start the process of becoming registered Cherokee tribal member?
You need to contact the tribe.
To whom this may concern : i have cherokee blood in me but i don’t how much bit i need to b check out for the percents of it so how can i do that can u help me with this ?! Thank you very much
An autosomal test would give you an estimate of how much Native. Then you’ll need to do genealogy to find that individual in your family history. Here’s a link – purchase the Family Finder test. It’s on sale now. http://www.kqzyfj.com/click-6754800-13710356
I was sick the day my class went over fractions….. lol. And Math is not my friend… lol
“And how does one have 2/3, exactly, with 4 grandparents. So, the story may not be the whole story.”
In your own words, it’s not possible to have 2/3. But in your own math example you show that it’s possible to have 34%. Close enough to 1/3 that people will say 1/3. The fact is, given many many generations of an ethnic background will result in nearly any possible mix between 0 and 100%.
Why are the 23andme Ancestry test coming back with very small amounts of Native blood? My husband’s grandmother is 1/2 Native and 1/2 European. His test came back that he was only .7 percent. His mother’s mother is full blooded Native and lived on the tribe camp. I don’t understand this.
This article will help. https://dna-explained.com/2018/12/28/ethnicity-is-just-an-estimate-yes-really/
My 4th great grandmother was a Native American but i’m not sure what Tribe. On my other side of my family i have another grandmother who was from the Algonkin Tribe in Quebec Canada. My DNA test didn’t show any Native American ancestry though.
Ok I’m 1/2 And my kids dad is 3/4…so I always said they were 2/3 lol I guess I need to redo my math 🤣
My mom millerd ellen wallace was full blood cherokee indian mixed with full blood other indians five tribes my daddy lurther A Ray. Dawes rolls born cherokee indian full blood midill oklahoma i was born mississippi red river salle E Ray I was adopted by my grandparents my daddy moma and step daddy mr fred smith susie S Smith dawes roll married name winnie sue smith my name was changed on birh certificate to sharonelaineRay. Then sharonelaine smith adopted my greatgrandpa greoge w smith cherokee indian born knot Tennessee full blood marred my greatgrandma essievbrooks smith cherokee indian full blood mixed other full blood indians knot Tennessee thank you sharonwalker very proud of my native american indian full blood mixed full blood other indians heritage
I have Cherokee ancestry that I inherited from both of my paternal grandparents. They were on the Dawes rolls. I have been using DNA Painter to map my segments. I downloaded my Ancestry Composition from 23andMe. It shows that my Native American segments show up in two places. One place is in Chromosome 1. DNA PAINTER shows that this overlaps a known pile-up area between positions 118,434,520 and 153,401,108.
I used GENETIC AFFAIRS Hybrid feature to obtain matches from Family Tree DNA, 23andMe, My Heritage and GEDMATCH. I found that in this region of Chromosome 1, I had numerous matches and I traced the admixture and ancestry of those matches where it was possible to do so. I found that the admixture of those matches usually showed that they had Native American ancestry. I was able to trace several of them back to a Cherokee Chief named Oconostota “Stalking Turkey” Moytoy (1704-1803).
One person has had their DNA tested in Family Tree DNA, 23andMe and My Heritage. I match this person in all three DNA sources. Because Family Tree DNA does not test segments in the pile-up region, my match with them is smaller. He also has Chief Moytoy as his ancestor.
I’m trying to see if I’m really 25% Cherokee Indian my grandmother is 100% my mother is 50% so am I 25%?
My mother does not know her father but said that her mother told her he was native american. I had a DNA test done showing 0% native. How far down would it show any percentage? My mother and father are white and my fathers parents were both white and my mothers mother was white. So only my mothers father supposedly was native. Should I be showing even a slight percentage of Native American?
Yes, you should. About 12%